March 14, 2025, 07:41:56 PM

Author Topic: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!  (Read 278706 times)

Offline MPbdy

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1095 on: June 12, 2024, 02:43:27 PM »
I did get up there this past weekend, and it took another full day, but made some progress.  Mixed feelings on it because it isn't a fix, but rather a workaround.  Still no idea what the root cause is, but I can move on from here.

I did not wind up needing to run a new shielded wire.  I started out the day with grounding the cam sensor to the block.  I thought this fixed it straight away, but turns out the gremlin was still there just dramatically reduced in severity.  I was immediately able to rev past ~4500 and all the way up to 7400.  Funny how fast it gets to the rev limiter when you're used to it cutting ignition at 4500 rpm haha.  I did bring it back down and held it steady at different RPM's from 4000 to 4500 and eventually it did start having small misfires.  Not the huge RPM dropouts as before - it would stumble and recover faster, and as mentioned it would let me rev past it cleanly on a faster sweep.

Looked at the datalogs and went down a rabbit hole of working on the crank sensor thinking it might be contributing as well.  I should've just stuck it out with the cam sensor only.  I wound up grounding the crank sensor with no change, fed 12V to the crank sensor with no change, and then fed 12V to the cam sensor and it worked 100%!  Dropped the starter for a third time and put the crank sensor back to normal wiring and it again worked fine - reved clean 100%, and I swept RPMs between 4000 and 5000 very slowly for at least 30 seconds and didn't once have a dropout.

The only little annoyance is the engine takes longer to crank now.  My theory is that since the cam sensor is hooked to 12V directly when you key the starter the voltage drops and spikes and might be causing some irregularities until the voltage settles out.  The switching point on these sensors is only 3.5V so it is 100% getting ENOUGH voltage to switch, but it is just really dirty on that 12V bus when you crank. 

To finalize things I need to clean up the wiring and make this a bit more permanent.  I don't see any other issues on my other sensors that would give me concern that the harness has other flaws.  I don't know the source of the noise in the harness, but I should be good to go.  I do have an unused regulated 12V pin from the ECU I can tap into and try that to see if cranking improves.  This will likely be how I wrap up this saga  and whatever it is, it is.

I do still need to find what the parasitic draw is I have yet to be able to find what is pulling 2 amps with the key off.

So to answer your question the engine feels smooth finally at every RPM, and still sounds awesome lol - especially at 7400 rpm.

Offline Esser

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1096 on: June 24, 2024, 01:37:20 PM »
Nice work tracing it down!! that's some good progress, I'm sure you're itching to drive it. I am and it's not even my car haha.

Offline MPbdy

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1097 on: June 27, 2024, 01:54:30 PM »
Yea I'm definitely itching to drive it.  I have gotten a bit jaded/burnt out after all this troubleshooting and wiring crap that needs to be done. I need to start making some big progress lol.  I am looking forward to putting some work in over the 4th of July weekend, at least one full day.

 

Offline MPbdy

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1098 on: July 30, 2024, 12:24:08 AM »
Yooooo so it has been a little bit.  After finally tracking down the cam sensor issue (or at least a bandaid fix) I had some major burnout and needed a break.  It has also been HOT.

Have had some time recently to get back to work, and my dad spent some of his retirement time on his own too putting the front dress together, finishing the power steering lines, put the AC lines and compressor back in and probably a few more odds and ends.

The new Turn One power steering pump is on and fits great. Lines worked out perfectly. It really couldn't have gone any better for install.

I also got a Motion Raceworks 3" pulley for the alternator.  It was getting wayyyyy over spun, and I plan to rev this thing out to 7500+, especially if the solid roller engine ever makes it in here.

We got the battery install done and cables routed - super stoked with how it turned out.  Was able to route it under the car very well protected from heat and any chance of hitting something.  I cut the rear bin out like 10 years ago, but wound up mounting a smaller lithium battery in a custom battery box on the frame rail.  Its a little ugly under there cosmetically, but the install is super clean.  This battery tray is a really nice piece, and it is designed to fit in the plastic bin without cutting it out.  I made it work mounting to the floor, but definitely would have been easier, looked nicer and required less use of a sledge hammer had I never cut the bin out lol. 

3 trashed batteries later over the years I feel like this is finally a permanent solution, and spins the engine over like its nothing.  This anti-grav battery is just so badass I can't recommend it enough. 

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/EHQtnmc5SbM


















Offline MPbdy

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1099 on: July 30, 2024, 12:37:00 AM »
I don't know how or why this happened, but this entire car just got rebuilt.  It was just supposed to be a quick engine swap and wrap up some loose ends.  I'll have to talk to my idiot project manager. 

It is getting really close though. I could bleed the clutch and go drive it right now so that's pretty cool.

I have a lot of wiring to do, and figure out how and where to mount the ECU to tuck the harness.  It is nearing the final odds and ends and clean-up to make everything nice and presentable.  I also have some interior work ahead of me that I'm dreading. I had to take the console out a couple times and even more tabs broke. I also have a new map pocket to install, but not sure the condition of the rest of the door panel.  I'm not entirely sure what to do for the car's future I think I really need to start planning for either a custom interior, or spend racks on replacement parts that are equally fragile and likely already broken.


Offline Venom13132

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Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1100 on: July 30, 2024, 08:23:31 AM »
I feel you on the whole car getting rebuilt.  Mine started as me just wanting to replace the subframe and spiralled into a full everything.   My LS1 needed a new engine harness and because of that I got a completely different engine and a Holley setup haha. 
1995 RX-7 Voodoo Blue- LS3, TR6060: Full Feed wide body, 57DR 18's, K-Sport coil-overs, 99 spec\ tails and Carbon Fiber spoiler, SpeedHut Gauges, Aeromotive fuel system, TwinZ Diffuser, Texas Speed LS3 Stage 2 v2 Cam Kit, Comp Cam's Rockers, McLeod Racing 6405507M RXT Street Twin Clutch kit, ATI-1918628 - Super Damper/balancer, Lot's of other stuff.
2010 Cadillac Escalade: Daily Driver and pulls my 18' car hauler

Offline Exidous

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1101 on: July 31, 2024, 06:50:17 AM »
I just put a 3" on my alternator too! Still have rock solid voltage at idle even with the 10% UD crank.
94 BB Sleeved gen IV LS7, MS3ProU with TC, RONIN 8.8 and LT's with custom 3.5"single to VAREX muffler.

Offline jwvand02

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1102 on: July 31, 2024, 01:44:35 PM »
I had the same problem with my alternator, I'm only spinning to 6400 but it's a track car so it gets there just about every shift, and I was going through an alternator every season.

Offline MPbdy

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1103 on: July 31, 2024, 02:20:37 PM »
I had the same problem with my alternator, I'm only spinning to 6400 but it's a track car so it gets there just about every shift, and I was going through an alternator every season.

After we blew a few up on our LS3 powered drag car that spins >7500 rpm it was time to take a closer look at it lol.  The LS2 alternator I have appears to not care mechanically about getting spun >> 20,000 rpm - but from what I hear it stops charging at too high of speeds. Last thing I want is voltage instability at high rpm. The factory pulley diameter puts it way over speed even by like ~5000 rpm.

Even with the 3" it spins a bit faster than it should, but I didn't want to risk dropping the speed too low at idle. 

The alternators we use on the drag car the armature was spreading open and contacting the case lol.  Oops.

Offline digitalsolo

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1104 on: July 31, 2024, 11:13:49 PM »
Problems I never, ever considered ^^^.  Haha
Blake MF'ing McBride
1988 Mazda RX7 - Turbo LS1/T56/ProEFI/8.8/Not Slow...   sold.
1965 Mustang Coupe - TT Coyote, TR6060, modern brakes/suspension...
2007 Aston Martin V8 Vantage - Gen V LT4/TR6060, upper/lower pullies, headers, tune.
2021 Tesla Model 3 Performance - Stock...ish.

Offline Exidous

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1105 on: August 02, 2024, 05:13:32 AM »
At 7200 the alternator is doing 16.2k and at 800 it's 1800. Voltage has been stable but if I up the idle to 900 it goes to 2050 with is a little better.
94 BB Sleeved gen IV LS7, MS3ProU with TC, RONIN 8.8 and LT's with custom 3.5"single to VAREX muffler.

Offline MPbdy

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1106 on: August 02, 2024, 11:36:17 AM »
Yea that’s cool. I guess it’d only be a problem at idle on like a stock vette idling at 600 in drive lol.

Motion has this handy chart I found after I did all my own math lol.


Offline jwvand02

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1107 on: August 02, 2024, 05:02:58 PM »
Has anyone looked at the PWM regulated alternators that are on the later gen4 cars and trucks? I don't really understand why the alternator fails when spun too fast, but was curious if you had manual control of the regulator if you could prevent it.

Offline MPbdy

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1108 on: August 02, 2024, 10:24:15 PM »
Has anyone looked at the PWM regulated alternators that are on the later gen4 cars and trucks? I don't really understand why the alternator fails when spun too fast, but was curious if you had manual control of the regulator if you could prevent it.

I have one on my car. I’m going to wire up an output from the Holley to control it, but not worry about moving the voltage around I’ll just command it to charge a fixed voltage. In constant voltage mode the current output will vary based on demand. From the factory they tried to eek out extra efficiency I don’t care about that obviously lol. With no PWM input it’ll default to charging at 13.6V I believe.

Most alternators are mechanically unable to survive being spun over 20,000 rpm.

Offline MPbdy

Re: 403 LS2 FD - LS7 Build for 2020!
« Reply #1109 on: August 02, 2024, 10:28:41 PM »
Just getting back home from playing hooky today and wrenching a bit. We’ve got family in town so it wasn’t the most focused day but made some progress.

I am relieved but also ultimately frustrated to learn that my 2 amp parasitic draw was a byproduct of a faulty multimeter, not my electrical system.

With everything connected my parasitic draw is only 10 milliamp when checked with a properly functioning meter…

Also got the clutch bled and flushed new fluid through the brakes.

I’m thinking I’m just now down to mounting my catch can somewhere and making an AN line for it, making a wiring harness for my custom I/O’s, and mounting the ECU and I/O module with the harness nicely tucked out of the way.